This one really bothers me. Whenever I maximize or tile windows (which is all the time), I see multiple layers of oddly rounded corners.
I think if there's any upside to Tahoe, it's that it might push me into blogging for the first time in my life ever, because I just can't keep things to myself.
I actually feel sorry for Apple's developers. I can't see how you can ship software so bad and inconsistent unless you've been handed a terrible design spec from Dye's team.
“Calm down, Postalcoder. We can vent tonight on our blog”
nnwright 8 minutes ago [-]
Mac OS's UX design has been in free fall the last 5-10 years (ever since the "iOS-ify everything" zeitgeist took root). Sincerely hope that they one day revert back, because the current UX is just godawful for any usecase I can imagine.
franciscop 1 hours ago [-]
This was one of the very few advantages of moving from Linux => MacOS, that at least most of the software was beautiful and consistent by default. I'm saddened to see that this is not true anymore. Been holding the Tahoe upgrade, and might just keep my macbook air m1 much longer than originally intended because of this.
mrcarrot 18 minutes ago [-]
I've started using Linux recently after not touching a desktop distro for 20-odd years, and I was surprised how good both Gnome and KDE look these days.
It certainly doesn't feel like there's a trillion-dollar-company difference between those two and Tahoe.
eastbound 9 minutes ago [-]
Beautiful, it’s nice, but the polished user experience was the ultimate argument.
- Raising the lid of the laptop and the base wouldn’t stick and fall off on the desk,
- A single-button click,
- A Cmd+C to copy and Ctrl+C for the interruption 7 in the terminal,
But now you have to configure that, yes, activate the right-click; yes, activate the three-finger click (wtf, 3 fingers); yes, activate the swipe-across-desktops on the magic mouse, all those items were selling points, so they should have studied the best behavior and implemented it by default on all deployments. But that requires studies, aesthetics, and a taste that only Steeve Jobs had, otherwise everything becomes an option. That’s right, I’m going to paraphrase Jobs’ argument against the 1990ies Microsoft:
The problem with Apple is they have no taste.
MaxikCZ 37 minutes ago [-]
Im gonna go against the grain here, so hold your pitchforks please, but I think its better than if it were consistent. Let me explain:
The author notices that adding a toolbar changes the radius, and to me it makes sense. If theres a toolbar, I know how much I can cut the corners, because the icons in the toolbar are not gonna be in far corner. At the same time, when I am unsure about what type of content might get cut by the corner, I will reduce the cut slightly to give that content more space.
I couldnt care less that one radius is not the same as another, I guess my OCD levels are not that high (yet?).
And I say all of this as someone who dislikes the glass design, and especially hates the small, slowly fading in volume/brightness indicators in the corner replacing the mid screen beautiful instant indicator.
gattilorenz 25 minutes ago [-]
So… the moment the Interface Designer in XCode can identify the app only has a single button at the center of a window, the window should be a circle? :)
oniony 1 minutes ago [-]
No, because circles are not as cool as squircles.
wahnfrieden 21 minutes ago [-]
Why should the two window varieties have the same corner radius? There's no design analysis here, only conservatism.
It's annoying, sure, but it's not worth disabling SIP.
ulbu 27 minutes ago [-]
read somewhere that maybe they’re preparing for OLED screens
Y-bar 4 minutes ago [-]
All iPhones since the iPhone X (2017), and not the iPhone SE line, has an OLED display. iPad Pro also has OLED.
ant6n 9 minutes ago [-]
How does that argument work?
defraudbah 5 minutes ago [-]
which will be even worse so you don't get that angry after years of bad design, lol
11 minutes ago [-]
satGuess 57 minutes ago [-]
I hadn’t noticed this before, but now I can’t unsee it.
UI inconsistencies like that tend to stand out once someone points them out.
unselect5917 1 hours ago [-]
This is one of those stories that I read and I'm like, "Someone wrote an article about that? I am definitely among my people, but I smell a front end developer."
etchalon 1 hours ago [-]
This feels like one of those "done for backwards compatibility and we tested not doing it and it was worse" things where everyone assumes incompetence over good-faith trade-offs being driven by release schedules.
iknowstuff 35 minutes ago [-]
Did the radius need changing
afandian 4 minutes ago [-]
Something needed changing! And the radius was something!
nikolay 3 days ago [-]
It keeps annoying me, too. How can their developers not see this?!
galad87 1 hours ago [-]
Because that's by design. The windows are meant to have different corner radius, they even explained it at WWDC. Then people forgot and rediscovered it again, like it was some new thing.
I am not saying that it's a good idea to have different corner radius, just that it's nothing new.
mikae1 1 hours ago [-]
> they even explained it at WWDC
Did they explain the reasoning?
Zafira 53 minutes ago [-]
> In the new design system, windows now have a softer, more generous corner radius, which varies based on the style of window. Windows with toolbars now use a larger radius, which is designed to wrap concentrically around the glass toolbar elements, scaling to match the size of the toolbar. Titlebar-only windows retain a smaller corner radius, wrapping compactly around the window controls. These larger corners provide a softer feel and elegant concentricity to the window…
conductr 32 minutes ago [-]
Just a bunch of words that raised no red flags, maybe sounded like a decent idea even, but when you see it how is your reaction not “oh, that’s bad”
I feel like this is the design process. You have ideas, they sound ok, you try them out, and then immediately you revert a lot of them. The ideas without the taste to know when not to do something is becoming the new Apple way
22 minutes ago [-]
galad87 58 minutes ago [-]
To align the window corner radius to the window close/minimize/resize buttons distance from the edge of the window.
nikolay 51 minutes ago [-]
I'd rather have my corners perfect and not have the constant eyesore of pixels bleeding from other windows' corners!
riffraff 2 hours ago [-]
I'm starting to suspect most people at Apple (and Microsoft) just spend time in a browser these days and so they don't notice how the desktop has gone shitty.
pjmlp 1 hours ago [-]
I won't be public shaming, but on a .NET podcast I just heard of an internal Microsoft project that took 7 years (!), to become public, it was a plain single Assembly .NET library nothing special (1 DLL).
littlecranky67 30 minutes ago [-]
Which one?
pjmlp 1 hours ago [-]
Priorities on what tickets to work on, and Apple being proudly underresourced.
jiehong 55 minutes ago [-]
Yep, it’s just ugly IMO
mulmen 59 minutes ago [-]
Because they did it on purpose to demonstrate their utter contempt for their users and to show us how wrong we are.
sgt 34 minutes ago [-]
Maybe this is intentional? Either way, doesn't look bad.
steve_adams_86 26 minutes ago [-]
I suppose that's subjective, because to me it looks distracting and tacky. I want the window chrome to be present, opinionated, yet consistent and plain. This is one of the many Tahoe-isms that violates the latter two. It's visual noise that detracts from one of the most basic utilities of the UI, which is to simply hold my applications in a regular, cohesive, predictable manner.
Maybe it shouldn't irritate me, but it's the first time I've encountered it in 30 years. I'm all for change and trying new things, but this doesn't feel like progress.
wahnfrieden 19 minutes ago [-]
It is intentional - it was explained at WWDC. And it looks good.
Rendered at 08:22:06 GMT+0000 (Coordinated Universal Time) with Vercel.
I think if there's any upside to Tahoe, it's that it might push me into blogging for the first time in my life ever, because I just can't keep things to myself.
I actually feel sorry for Apple's developers. I can't see how you can ship software so bad and inconsistent unless you've been handed a terrible design spec from Dye's team.
edit: On my screen, three layers' corners https://hcker.news/tahoe-corners.png
It certainly doesn't feel like there's a trillion-dollar-company difference between those two and Tahoe.
- Raising the lid of the laptop and the base wouldn’t stick and fall off on the desk,
- A single-button click,
- A Cmd+C to copy and Ctrl+C for the interruption 7 in the terminal,
But now you have to configure that, yes, activate the right-click; yes, activate the three-finger click (wtf, 3 fingers); yes, activate the swipe-across-desktops on the magic mouse, all those items were selling points, so they should have studied the best behavior and implemented it by default on all deployments. But that requires studies, aesthetics, and a taste that only Steeve Jobs had, otherwise everything becomes an option. That’s right, I’m going to paraphrase Jobs’ argument against the 1990ies Microsoft:
The problem with Apple is they have no taste.
The author notices that adding a toolbar changes the radius, and to me it makes sense. If theres a toolbar, I know how much I can cut the corners, because the icons in the toolbar are not gonna be in far corner. At the same time, when I am unsure about what type of content might get cut by the corner, I will reduce the cut slightly to give that content more space.
I couldnt care less that one radius is not the same as another, I guess my OCD levels are not that high (yet?).
And I say all of this as someone who dislikes the glass design, and especially hates the small, slowly fading in volume/brightness indicators in the corner replacing the mid screen beautiful instant indicator.
I am not saying that it's a good idea to have different corner radius, just that it's nothing new.
Did they explain the reasoning?
I feel like this is the design process. You have ideas, they sound ok, you try them out, and then immediately you revert a lot of them. The ideas without the taste to know when not to do something is becoming the new Apple way
Maybe it shouldn't irritate me, but it's the first time I've encountered it in 30 years. I'm all for change and trying new things, but this doesn't feel like progress.