I hope this doesn't become the new norm where government becomes the bottleneck for innovation in the AI space.
It's worrying that with no formal and transparent policy framework that the government will be picking winners and losers and stifling innovation.
There's been no public policy, executive order, legislation, or otherwise on this, I wonder if anyone has filed FOIA requests for these decisions or the conversations between the Executive Branch and AI companies.
winterismute 19 minutes ago [-]
Indeed, I find quite ironic that some people in tech in the US complain about EU "regulations first" approach, but then their government seem to arbitrarily stop things from being released because, well, there is no established policy on safety guarantees or other similar aspects.
ronsor 15 minutes ago [-]
This arrangement is already dubiously legal. The government is already being sued over the Fable incident with Anthropic.
No amount of rules can stop people who are willing to break them. Only enforcement can.
WarmWash 6 minutes ago [-]
On some level though we have to be cognizant of the potential for harm these models have.
LLMs are still a little loosey goosey, and we are right on the cusp (if not there already) for an agent to hack a bank and steal money for some rando teenager with a penchant for jail breaking.
The regulations are and will be negative, but don't lose sight of what LLMs can do off the leash.
yunwal 3 minutes ago [-]
> On some level
The appropriate level would be regulation though? Like I just don't get how we can argue that arbitrarily throttling companies is ok.
alberto467 8 minutes ago [-]
Let’s be real, as an EU citizen I have zero doubts that those models would also have been blocked if developed in EU.
I like the US approach better: regulate when the need for it arises, not before when you don’t know how the situation is going to evolve.
JoshTriplett 30 seconds ago [-]
> regulate when the need for it arises
I agree. But that need has absolutely arisen. The US government is not exactly the best steward for this kind of thing, but some model other than "race each other as fast as we can" is desperately needed here.
refulgentis 13 minutes ago [-]
Our AI czar, David Sacks, whined and moaned about the idea of regulation, even said Anthropic begging for some guidance was asking for “regulatory capture” and was gloating about how right he was they wanted it, 2 weeks ago.
I wonder if he understands why, now.
GaryBluto 10 minutes ago [-]
> Anthropic begging for some guidance
Anthropic was "begging" to make it harder for competing companies to be founded.
ronsor 9 minutes ago [-]
They got the "leopards ate my face" ending.
refulgentis 5 minutes ago [-]
No, it’s not leopards at my face / irony / comeuppance, because that would involve regulation.
I understand it’s very satisfying if you wanted Anthropic “punished” for asking for real regulation to see this. I can’t deny there was a little bit of me at first that felt that way.
It’s untenable, a first order reaction, that I regret intellectually, because if you were against regulation, you’re certainly against waves whatever this is.
basisword 16 minutes ago [-]
This applies to most things when it comes to the USG/citizens. Protectionism is communist unless they do it. Thinking about developing a nuke? Well bomb you first despite being the only people to ever use them. Free speech and press - unless we don’t like what you say.
postalcoder 44 minutes ago [-]
Not a fan of the phased release but I do remember when access to gpt-3 was gated and access to gpt-4 had a staged release.
ppl are acting like limited release is unprecedented when, in fact, has been the norm until a few years ago.
wahnfrieden 34 minutes ago [-]
Was it the norm for Trump's team to hand-select the specific customers who get access in the staged rollout, and to choose the date of wide release?
postalcoder 33 minutes ago [-]
The AI companies were all asking for the government to regulate them. The government is doing what the companies asked for them to do.
You can argue that, by government, they meant some legislative process, but I'd argue that regulation via bad executive order is much better than regulation via bad legislation because the former is tractable. I say this as an EO minimalist.
8 minutes ago [-]
simsla 2 minutes ago [-]
There's a pretty big difference between "we need laws and regulations" and "let Trump do whatever he feels like today."
ctoth 19 minutes ago [-]
Yeah pretty sure we had a whole bruhaha ~250 years ago about this question of where precisely power belonged. I for one think we mostly got it right then and would be reluctant to shift the power back to the individual sovereign and away from the people.
wahnfrieden 30 minutes ago [-]
Ok so you agree this has not been the norm. It seemed like you were clarifying your original message but it was a change of topic, from "this has been the norm" to "this hasn't been the norm but they got what they were asking for" (or what they deserved if not exactly what they asked for)
postalcoder 22 minutes ago [-]
What an unpleasant form of discourse.
CamperBob2 3 minutes ago [-]
Welcome to HN. There's cake in the breakroom.
mptest 22 minutes ago [-]
> The AI companies were all asking for the government to regulate them
pretty shallow take. they asked for sensible, transparent, tech aware regulations. this is not that.
postalcoder 20 minutes ago [-]
[dead]
baq 10 minutes ago [-]
Shadow of export controls is very long indeed.
The Project is almost here.
CamperBob2 4 minutes ago [-]
It's worrying that with no formal and transparent policy framework that the government will be picking winners and losers and stifling innovation.
The market will demand such a framework. I suspect that's the larger idea here, in that Amodei not only wants to be in the room when that framework is written, he wants to be at the head of the table.
He apparently wants it so badly he's willing to set back his own company's IPO to make it happen, given that there can be no pure-play AI IPOs until the regulatory picture is sorted out.
rvz 43 minutes ago [-]
This move was obvious the moment Anthropic pleaded to the government to regulate them.
As predicted, [0] it has now been applied to OpenAI and soon anyone else releasing highly capable models.
Wondering how long it'll take for the US to make it... more difficult to use Chinese models once they've caught up.
llelouch 15 minutes ago [-]
Seems like it hasn't been applied to openai. Anthropic can't even release this to partners. Openai can. I wonder why.
18 minutes ago [-]
iAMkenough 10 minutes ago [-]
But think about how terrible it would be if “foreigners” (including the ones that work on these models) got access!
We must clutch our pearls and cite National Security as a reason to pick winners and losers, just like the government did for Fable.
alberto467 6 minutes ago [-]
There would be real risks yeah.
This is not something to joke about, its real.
tiahura 50 minutes ago [-]
Just because you don't get access, doesn't mean they're not innovating.
esperent 18 minutes ago [-]
Maybe, but you know who is also innovating, not gating access, and at most 6-9 months away from reaching parity with US frontier labs?
cromka 19 minutes ago [-]
Also applies to Chinese models. Give it 5 more months of US admin locking out US models and let's see what the market will look like for OoenAI and Anthropic IPO.
logicchains 42 minutes ago [-]
Their innovation relies on a huge amount of investment made under the assumption that they'll continue to be able to provide frontier models to a global audience. If it turns out the US government only lets them sell gimped models to non-citizens then they'll forfeit the whole global market to China and investors will flee like rats.
vonneumannstan 52 minutes ago [-]
Unfortunately this is better than the status quo which is a totally unregulated disaster. These models are only getting more capable and cannot simply be released whenever OpenAI or Anthropic feel like the vibes are good enough. We don't let passengers fly on unvetted jumbo jets either and we prevent them from flying when they have problems.
bigyabai 42 minutes ago [-]
> We don't let passengers fly on unvetted jumbo jets either and we prevent them from flying when they have problems.
This is Mr. Fart's Favorite Colors all over again. Our "vetting" process is not any more useful than the billion-dollar metal detector you can skip with a TSA Precheck. It arguably does not deter the most dangerous attacks even slightly. What happens when a mentally-ill pilot locks their copilot out of the cockpit? Well, we write off a crowd of passengers and then "vet" the next jet as a safe vehicle.
AI will be the same way. These "safety" measures are performative and do not even slightly address the actual threat surface of the technology. Arguably, it cannot even be done.
alberto467 4 minutes ago [-]
What knowledge or skills do you have to be hating on the certification process for airplanes?
It’s just getting ridiculous at this point. There are plenty of industries regulated and certified by national or international agencies. And no they don’t get to do what they want.
Carrok 41 minutes ago [-]
You have fallen victim to what is known as “marketing”.
gxs 47 minutes ago [-]
What a terrible take
First of all, who said this is a disaster?
Second of all, OP never even said anything about no regulation - they specifically said they wanted transparency which is 100% valid and better than a world where the government baby proofs everything for you
Models are already censored - and who they are or aren't uncensored for has a lot of implications which are way worse
And the jets is a terrible example - you picked one of THE highest regulated industries where NOBODY has a problem with regulation
Fraterkes 1 hours ago [-]
"We believe in broad access, and we plan to make GPT‑5.6 Sol, Terra, and Luna generally available in the coming weeks. As part of our ongoing engagement with the U.S. government, we previewed our plans and the models’ capabilities ahead of today’s launch. At their request, we are starting with a limited preview for a small group of trusted partners whose participation has been shared with the government, before releasing more broadly. During this preview, we will continue testing and coordinating closely with partners as we work toward broader availability. We don’t believe this kind of government access process should become the long-term default. It keeps the best tools from users, developers, enterprises, cyber defenders, and global partners who need them. We are taking this short-term step because we believe it is the strongest path to broader availability in the coming weeks, while we work with the Administration to develop the cyber Executive Order framework and a repeatable process for future model releases."
This amount of courting the current administration is pretty scary imo.
stronglikedan 2 minutes ago [-]
seems pretty smart to me. opens doors and provides opportunities that those that don't court the government will miss out on. of course, if they're principled, that's okay (regardless of which admin it is), but the reality is most companies aren't. gotta get a leg up somehow.
tomComb 45 minutes ago [-]
> This amount of courting the current administration is pretty scary imo.
That’s ironic – I interpreted that paragraph with the opposite slant: positively. If that’s what the government mandates then these companies, in the end, have little choice, so was at least relieved to see them publicly pushing back.
logicchains 40 minutes ago [-]
>these companies, in the end, have little choice
They absolutely do have a choice, Anthropic and OpenAI could fight it in court. Iran showed Trump is a coward, he wouldn't risk tanking the only industry still keeping the stock market growing.
derwiki 29 minutes ago [-]
It’s all speculation but I think he would have no qualms about tanking the only industry keeping the stock market growing. But given Kushner’s OAI investments, Trump stands to benefit personally from not tanking the industry.
ls612 12 minutes ago [-]
“Wouldn’t it be a shame if we export controlled all of your models and revoked the visas and green cards of all of your non US researchers. You should really reconsider challenging our orders in court. Also remember you have 16% public support and if the president endorsed it a national data center moratorium would pass with bipartisan majorities.”
iAMkenough 8 minutes ago [-]
Do it. Make the Republicans show how much they value the “free market” after all. Trump’s approval rating isn’t much higher.
inquirerGeneral 20 minutes ago [-]
[dead]
chasd00 54 minutes ago [-]
I wonder what's going to happen when the administration rolls over to the OtherTeam(tm). If they've established a good relationship with Team A then Team B is automatically going to hate their guts.
speedgoose 23 minutes ago [-]
Perhaps they estimate that the administration won’t change for a long long time.
mohsen1 45 minutes ago [-]
NYT's The Daily covered this a few days ago. Has a few interesting details about what went on...
Anthropic's fear-mongering and marketing is the reason we have these restrictions in the first place.
Despite their virtue signaling, Anthropic is the only major lab that has never released an open weights model, has been caught intentionally nerfing a model after release (Opus 4.6), intentionally and silently degrades performance for suspected competitors and AI researchers, complains incessantly about distillation when everyone is doing it (and after they settled for pirating books), and wants to pull the ladder out from everyone trying to catch up.
They're anti-consumer and only concerned with holding the power themselves.
I'm not a fan of Altman, but Anthropic is the worst actor in the space, and I hope they lose.
The common denominator between "GPT-2 is too dangerous to release" and Anthropic is Dario.
llelouch 14 minutes ago [-]
Sam Altman was doing interviews talking about p(doom). They all were requesting regulation just not this opaque ad hoc kind.
tiahura 41 minutes ago [-]
What about openai's fear mongering, or googles, or JP Morgans, or Frank Herbert's, or Arthur C. Clarke's or Samuel Butler's?
If you can't envision plausible scenarios where very bad things happen because of a malevolent actor, ChatGPT 6, and a little bad luck - you need to think harder.
dominotw 56 minutes ago [-]
current players in the space love the regulatory capture
fsloth 52 minutes ago [-]
There is no bad publicity! I wonder if OpenAI explicilty asked for this.
tiahura 46 minutes ago [-]
Do you feel the same way about FDA approvals?
I mean, it seems like common sense - a limited beta test before widespread rollout. I'm not convinced they'll ever come up with a good framework for dealing with the cyber & bio issues, but getting triggered by a beta test rollout seems overboard.
loudmax 9 minutes ago [-]
It is common sense, and with literally any other administration in the past century it would seem like a good idea.
I have zero confidence that this particular administration has any interest in regulating the industry for the good of the country, much less for the good of humanity. They will use regulation to maximize personal profit for themselves and their cronies, at the expense of the nation. I would not have thought that of any other US administration in the past 100 years.
In the longer run, it probably won't matter. If the level of corruption we see currently becomes the norm, then the US is facing much bigger problems than counter-productive industrial policy.
Aeolun 49 minutes ago [-]
This is pure openai though. I can call anthropic misguided, but openai is just slimy.
HyperL0gi 57 minutes ago [-]
Here is a trend I'm noticing:
- GPT-5 mini costs $0.25/$2 and will be discontinued in December.
- GPT-5.4 mini costs $0.75/$4.5 and is supposed to be the replacement.
- GPT-5.4 nano costs $0.2/$1.25 and, while it ranks better in benchmarks than GPT-5 mini, it's not even close when you test it in real scenarios.
So you're left being forced to go to GPT 5.4 mini if you use 5 mini today.
The same thing is happening here as their “Luna“ model will cost $1/$6.
Can't we just stay with the models we actually want? I don't need GPT 5.4 mini. GPT-5 does the job.
Maybe it’s the realization that it was never that cheap in the first place and they're forcing us to upgrade in a slow and painful way.
wolttam 50 minutes ago [-]
If you have no need for Anthropic/OpenAI's frontier model capability, you may be better served with an open-weight model that can't be taken away.
paxys 49 minutes ago [-]
Unless you are hosting it yourself on your own infrastructure it absolutely can be taken away.
atherton94027 40 minutes ago [-]
For all intents and purposes you'll be able to move an open weight model wherever you want.
I really dislike this rhetoric, you sound like the FSF guys who are like "you're not free until you're running coreboot with zero binary blobs". Sure they have a point but also, most people are fine running regular linux.
sauwan 1 minutes ago [-]
Unless the US Gov bans inference companies from serving Chinese models to US customers...
adrianN 32 minutes ago [-]
Most FSF guys actually have very nuanced views on the topic and you’re doing everyone a disservice by reducing it to an extremist sound bite.
GTP 30 minutes ago [-]
Still, with the same model being served by multiple providers, it is much less likely to disappear entirely, even if you would like to keep using a cloud provider. Worst-case scenario, you change providers. Or you use OpenRouter as a proxy.
amunozo 48 minutes ago [-]
But you have multiple providers, not just one.
paxys 43 minutes ago [-]
And every single one of those providers would buckle under government pressure.
Fable itself is hosted on all major cloud providers. How many offer it today?
minimaxir 41 minutes ago [-]
The providers on OpenRouter are not all in the US.
paxys 31 minutes ago [-]
That doesn’t mean they are immune to US laws. If they want to continue to operate in the largest market in the world they will fall in line.
And if you are a legit American business you aren’t going to illegally bypass import/export controls.
svachalek 18 minutes ago [-]
More importantly, the download is out there. You can download it yourself today, and if it's that important to you, you can buy the hardware too.
cyanydeez 46 minutes ago [-]
I'm sure he's referring to the tightening of internet controls around social media as an extrapolation to controlling websites, etc.
logicchains 45 minutes ago [-]
Even in that case it can't be taken away; GPT and Claude are banned in China yet there's still a huge black market for tokens.
GaggiX 48 minutes ago [-]
Popular open models on Openrouter have dozens of providers.
paxys 55 minutes ago [-]
It’s the same as the SaaS model. Price keeps going up, and to justify it they keep forcing you to upgrade to new versions with features that nobody asked for.
mistic92 31 minutes ago [-]
Its happening to Anthropic Haiku and Gemini Flash/Flash lite. All of them are increasing prices and deprecating cheap models.
simonw 48 minutes ago [-]
On Nano "it's not even close when you test it in real scenarios" - what have you seen? What kind of things can GPT-5 Mini handle that GPT-5.4 Nano cannot?
neosat 51 minutes ago [-]
Good observations. There's definitely a trend in pricing increasing but also balanced by innovations and availability of other models (both open and closed) emerging as alternatives. It's natural for the labs to explore how much they can push pricing, and for competitors to explore how they can treat that margin as their opportunity to grow their business.
Eventually the pricing should be more stable.
benterix 29 minutes ago [-]
> Eventually the pricing should be more stable.
Why do you think so? This game can be played forever, you just need strong marketing and orgs gullible enough to pay a higher price for a minor upgrade.
malnourish 51 minutes ago [-]
Hardware hosting old models isn't hosting new models. If you want consistent models, host your own open weights ones.
48 minutes ago [-]
tosh 42 minutes ago [-]
discontinuing the cheaper options is a risky move for openai
will trigger re-evaluations of models by other labs + inference providers
gonzalohm 53 minutes ago [-]
Yeah, this is the classic silicon valley strategy of selling at a loss and then once they have captured the market inflate prices.
See Uber, Netflix, etc.
simianwords 27 minutes ago [-]
This is a constantly repeated conspiracy theory and is not true at all. The api costs do increase but aggregate costs per task decrease. The question is: do people need lower intelligence models at all? The answer is a resounding NO!
How many people do you see using haiku or sonnet? I see very few and most people default to the latest model and just play with thinking effort. I think three layers are good enough and supporting more is not a good UX.
sourcecodeplz 43 minutes ago [-]
who tf would use mini when you have dsv4 flash
cyanydeez 47 minutes ago [-]
No, you can't. These companies have two infrastructures: model training and model inference.
Inference needs to cache, it can't cache random model data, so it's essentially dedicated; it can't spin up models on demand, it has to know what demand is coming.
These companies are going to end up with very few models offered and that's probably generous. They might end up with just one model and you pay for removing it's safe guards.
impulser_ 13 minutes ago [-]
Again, if you think we the people are getting access to AGI you're a fool.
These models aren't even that smart and they are already trying to control them and lock them down to a handful of people.
Then these executive and VC wonder why people hate AI and are against them.
Because the future is heading toward intelligence for the rich and you stuck with whatever model they want you to have.
The next step is banning open source models.
The future is not looking so bright if these models are already going locked down to whoever the government what's to have them.
This is no different than the government banning books because they don't want you to learn.
jdw64 53 minutes ago [-]
I think GPT writes code the best. How well will it write in version 5.6? It gives me chills.
Recently, I went head-to-head with GPT on nearly 2,000 lines of code, and GPT's solution was superior and faster. I even referenced multiple codebases on GitHub while trying, but they were incomparable to GPT.
So using GPT brings both fear and excitement.
The fear comes from realizing that this level of code is now the average for most people. The excitement comes from knowing that I can now study and learn at this level too.
I'm really looking forward to seeing how much more advanced the code will be with the upgrade to 5.6.
seviu 46 minutes ago [-]
I am on the opposite camp. Open models are starting to perform better. GPT 5.5 keeps on messing things up.
On the contrary, pi + glm + DeepSeek… bliss.
Fable was a different kind of beast though. Rip.
arizen 19 minutes ago [-]
Ditto on GLM 5.2 + DeepSeek V4 Flash combo.
For most important work (complex, cross-domain inquiries etc.), I still rely on Codex GPT 5.5 though.
enraged_camel 8 minutes ago [-]
>> I am on the opposite camp. Open models are starting to perform better. GPT 5.5 keeps on messing things up.
I'm working in a 600k+ LoC codebase that has complex domain-specific logic and lots of moving parts. I find that Codex 5.5 is pretty good at surgical fixes, but does not go out of its way to explore and figure out what those surgical fixes might break. So I only use it to work on parts of the system that are pretty isolated from everything else so that risk of regression is small.
HarHarVeryFunny 19 minutes ago [-]
I'm suspect on how much of a coding advance it will be.
Seems odd that their announcement has zero coding benchmarks, with the closest relating thing being terminal bench.
jdw64 11 minutes ago [-]
Maybe I'll know once I try it? Honestly, for small functions or methods, I don't think there's a huge difference between models. But the larger the code gets, the more noticeable the difference seems to be.
Personally, I think this kind of coding experience varies from person to person
vanuatu 8 minutes ago [-]
sadly with all the labs benchmaxxing I feel like you just have to try the model for a while to really evaluate how good it is, especially for each individual use case
Well, GPT referenced every GitHub code base, no wonder it won! :)
pawelduda 43 minutes ago [-]
How do you judge what is a good or bad thing to learn from a LLM? So you don't have to unlearn the bad bits later
jdw64 41 minutes ago [-]
When I searched for papers on using LLMs, I found that typically, you can have an LLM generate code and then ask it to find GitHub projects similar to that code. Then you can learn by looking at the pull requests and seeing how they structure things
In the old days, if I wanted to understand why memory offsets, padding techniques, or data layout structures were written a certain way, I had to stare at a senior programmer's code all day or wait for them to reply. But LLMs, while they do flatter me, explain things at a level I can actually understand. And LLMs don't get annoyed.
jdw64 23 minutes ago [-]
There's a lot of tacit knowledge in programming.
-Why do you cut API boundaries this way?
-Why do you change the order of struct fields?
-Why do you deliberately insert padding?
Most of it depends on the background and context. Sometimes you add it, sometimes you don't. To understand this tacit knowledge, you need access to senior developers. But their attitude often depends on how promising the student is and what background they come from. On top of that, you don't have to rely on the respondent's mood, authority, or availability.
Programming is fundamentally a field that requires seniors. In my case, I had no such seniors at all. I learned to code by buying codebases from failed companies and studying them. My first job didn't hire me as an employee—they hired me as the CEO of a subcontracting company (because that was structurally more advantageous for the contract). So I wasn't given the patience to learn programming fundamentals gradually. I had to pay penalties if I failed. Most of the projects I worked on were the kind where failure meant bankruptcy for me. Naturally, there was no one to teach me.
Most of my knowledge comes from reverse-engineering the code I purchased.
People say LLM code contains falsehoods, but commercially sold code has always had falsehoods too. Honestly, if we're just talking ratios, LLM code has fewer falsehoods.
In that sense, I still think it's a matter of context. If LLM code is false, was human code ever really true? LLMs do lie. They generate plenty of incorrect code. But humans do the same thing. If a problem comes up, you just look it up then and there. For me, LLMs and humans aren't all that different.
mohsen1 49 minutes ago [-]
> Additionally, we’re introducing a new `ultra` mode that goes beyond the capabilities of a single agent by leveraging subagents to accelerate complex work.
I'm curious about how does this work? Do the subagents also get to use the same tools? Will the client be flooded with tool calls? Why extra pricing for a new "model" when the same thing can happen in the client with more controls?
And if it's an army of subagents, why do they compare it to Fable and Mythos? Those models with similar harness would probably bench better I'm guessing
gck1 14 minutes ago [-]
If it's anything like ClaudeCode's ultracode, it's nothing new or revolutionary.
It's essentially a bunch of subagents being called by a deterministic script written by the main model thread, each eating tokens for lunch and output of which is synthesized by an orchestrator agent.
mohsen1 12 minutes ago [-]
Confusion is: ultracode is not a different model with its own benchmarks
gck1 7 minutes ago [-]
Neither is OpenaAI's ultra. Article specifically calls it 'mode' and it's not even mentioned in the model card.
Yeah, I'm interested too. My guess for the reason, if not purely to eke out more performance, is so they can cleanly gather real-world data on this kind of usage.
derwiki 22 minutes ago [-]
Don’t all the major harnesses (pi, Claude code, codex) utilize sub agents? Def if you direct it to, but I’ve seen at least pi spin them up without explicit instruction.
alansaber 21 minutes ago [-]
Absolutely yes
27 minutes ago [-]
alansaber 22 minutes ago [-]
I'm shocked they didn't use subagents already. Maybe they're just talking about their web deployment being unified with codex?
simianwords 26 minutes ago [-]
Claude also has ultra code mode which is exactly the same thing. This seems to be different from pro however.
pixelpoet 1 hours ago [-]
Are these models still relevant for people outside the US? I get the impression we're stuck on GPT 5.5 and Opus 4.8 pretty much permanently now, and relying on Chinese models in future.
SyneRyder 26 minutes ago [-]
Not only that, but using Opus 4.8 [1m] right now outside the US, and suddenly I only have a 500k context window. I really hope this is just a strange Claude Code bug, but I had access to a 1 Million window before, and it wouldn't entirely surprise me if context window length becomes another US export restriction.
The Anthropic page here seems to say that Max users should have access to the full 1 Million window for 4.8:
I was already setting up my infra to experiment with GLM 5.2 and its 1 Million token window before this happened. I think I'm glad I did.
seviu 35 minutes ago [-]
Dont worry, chinese models will distill frontier ones, quite fast.
The excuse they give is borderline childish. I get the thing about slow rollout, make sure partners get to fix the bugs, etc...
But bad actors are hard working motivated entities with tens of thousand of fake ids, and american citizens working for them, for pennies.
All while the ones like or you sit at a crossfire which is borderline useless.
I cant wait to see what Qwen did with the massive distillation they made out of Opus 4.8 and Fable aka Mythos aka pretty sure they jailbroke it.
gandreani 5 minutes ago [-]
Easily the most interesting part of this announcement is buried in the second to last paragraph:
"We're also launching GPT‑5.6 Sol on Cerebras at up to 750 tokens per second in July, bringing frontier intelligence to customers at unprecedented speed. Access will initially be limited to select customers as we expand capacity."
750 tokens/s on a frontier model is going to be extremely interesting. I doubt this new version is anything but a version bump in terms of capabilities but if we can start getting these answers back faster, they end up being more useful.
Just off the top of my head, I can think of the tedious task of finding certain functionality within a codebase. I usually can't beat an AI agent harness at this task today. If the AI model is 3x faster I have less of chance.
supermdguy 11 minutes ago [-]
> We're also launching GPT‑5.6 Sol on Cerebras at up to 750 tokens per second in July, bringing frontier intelligence to customers at unprecedented speed.
This is really exciting. I work on voice AI, and we're still using 4.1/4.1 mini since none of the frontier models come close on latency. I'm excited to be able to have more interactive experiences, I think it'll unlock new ways of working with these models.
ddp26 1 hours ago [-]
I'm going to pre-register my prediction that GPT-5.6 Sol is significantly behind Claude Fable 5, as evaluated by general consensus once time has passed for people to get familiar with both.
CuriouslyC 49 minutes ago [-]
Claude will win on "vibes" and it'll be close in coding but considering how incremental Fable is above 5.5 in terms of overall smarts, there's no way 5.6 isn't considerably smarter on the whole.
hmate9 1 hours ago [-]
What is this prediction based on?
gpm 60 minutes ago [-]
I suspect the same just based on their versioning scheme fwiw.
jstummbillig 57 minutes ago [-]
solid
Onavo 49 minutes ago [-]
Fable is allegedly a massive model (estimates between 6-10+ trillion, with a few hundred billion active). If 5.6 is just an incremental upgrade over 5.5 (at the same model size) then it won't be able to fully compete with Fable just yet.
minimaxir 59 minutes ago [-]
I suspect GPT-5.6 Sol will at-the-least be affordable.
MostlyStable 49 minutes ago [-]
"Affordable" depends on what you need. When a task is able to be achieved by two different calibers of model, it's obviously more cost effective to use the less capable model, in the same way that you wouldn't hire a math PhD to do simple addition.
If what you need is only possible with the more capable model then the "affordability" of the less capable model is sort of irrelevant. If what you need is a novel mathematical proof, it doesn't matter that a high school student is "more affodable". You need the math PhD.
As "old" models get more and more capable, it's going to be an increasingly important skill to be able to adequately recognize when a task requires a frontier model and when it doesn't, so that the less capable (and therefore cheaper) model can be used.
Y_Y 43 minutes ago [-]
Affordable? I'd settle for available.
simianwords 25 minutes ago [-]
I’m countering this prediction by stating that Fable and Sol will be somewhat similar - this has always been the trend and I see no reason why this should stop now.
dimgl 57 minutes ago [-]
why
chanbam 56 minutes ago [-]
Because he likes attention and wants to feel special
mccoyb 1 hours ago [-]
When will GPT-5.6 Protomolecule drop? Me and the boys on Eros can't wait to get our hands on it!
slopinthebag 57 minutes ago [-]
I'm excited for GPT-5.7 Pneumonoultramicroscopicsilicovolcanoconiosis, hope they drop it soon
dodslaser 50 minutes ago [-]
GPT-5.8 Llanfairpwllgwyngyll
w4yai 43 minutes ago [-]
You mean Llanfairpwllgwyngyllgogerychwyrndrobwllllantysiliogogogoch ?
derwiki 21 minutes ago [-]
… do you folks listen to Soft Skills Engineering? This has been a running joke on that podcast for a while
wasting_time 18 minutes ago [-]
What is happening. I feel like I'm getting an aneurysm reading these comments.
da_grift_shift 41 minutes ago [-]
For me, it's GPT-5.9 Year of the Whisper-Quiet Maytag Dishmaster
slopinthebag 29 minutes ago [-]
I think Aramco GPT Coca Cola 6.0 will be a step change.
loufe 1 hours ago [-]
"Next generation model"
If it was the next generation, why isn't it a major version change..?
HarHarVeryFunny 9 minutes ago [-]
AFAIK there is no difference between "generation" and "version". Version naming/numbering depends on how good it turns out to be, and competition. If the competition releases something then you need to push something out too.
Calling it 5.6 creates the least possible expectations, and therefore more potential for positive feedback.
The Sol/Terra/Luna naming is interesting. I wonder what Anthropic are considering for their next models? "Terminator", "Armageddon"?
GTP 22 minutes ago [-]
Some assume it was to try to slip under the radar and avoid being limited by the government as they did with Fable.
therepanic 17 minutes ago [-]
By all appearances, they did not succeed in doing so.
ryangst_1 59 minutes ago [-]
LLM devs can't do version control
appplication 56 minutes ago [-]
Honestly LLMs are the ideal candidate for CalVer. It’s not like there’s any real API so there’s no backwards compatibility to maintain.
Even Apple adopted and standardized on it for their latest platform releases.
andy12_ 31 minutes ago [-]
I think it makes more sense to make it so that major versions are different pretraining runs, and minor versions are simply the same pretraining run that was finetuned to different degrees. But it seems that that isn't cool anymore.
goldenarm 25 minutes ago [-]
They could hold the GPT-6 name for the IPO
kaizenite 53 minutes ago [-]
Because if it sucks, they can just default to "It was a minor version change anyways"
postalcoder 34 minutes ago [-]
my guess is gpt-6 is reserved for the Vera Rubin pretrain.
58 minutes ago [-]
psychoslave 58 minutes ago [-]
Semantic is passé, word models moved to the next generation.
dominotw 57 minutes ago [-]
vibe versioning
cruffle_duffle 44 minutes ago [-]
To be fair, versioning has always been vibes based.
HarHarVeryFunny 31 minutes ago [-]
> spent multiple weeks finding weaknesses, pressure-testing our system, and hardening it against real-world attacks
Multiple weeks!
Not just 5 work days, but at least 10!
type4 1 hours ago [-]
Great, so when do we lowly code-serfs get access to it?
tedsanders 34 minutes ago [-]
Unfortunately we're not in a position where we can promise an exact date, but we expect it to take weeks (not days or months). It's the best coding model we've ever trained and we're bummed we can't release it to everyone yet. When we do launch, we'll share a lot more evals and testimonials and demos that help show what it's good/bad at. Personally hoping that both GPT-5.6 Sol and Fable 5 get broadly released soon so that everyone (myself included) can try them head to head.
(I work at OpenAI.)
davidwritesbugs 51 minutes ago [-]
Shutup peasant, you'll get it when we say. And be grateful.
paxys 39 minutes ago [-]
How much are you able to contribute to Trump’s election fund?
Brainspackle 27 minutes ago [-]
i have access and i'm just a regular dude
12 minutes ago [-]
nopakos 7 minutes ago [-]
What I find amusing is that people where mocking EU for regulations and now this is happening in the US.
I know that Europe is behind in AI but still...
jimmydoe 27 minutes ago [-]
Is there a list of Gov-approved companies?
If this is the new norm, we as workers should all start look for jobs in those companies.
modeless 48 minutes ago [-]
> We don’t believe this kind of government access process should become the long-term default. It keeps the best tools from users, developers, enterprises, cyber defenders, and global partners who need them.
I'm very glad to see them say this explicitly and prominently.
m3h 12 minutes ago [-]
If GPT-5.6 preview is not available outside US government approved "trusted partners", I don't see how the General Available can be trusted later.
Who knows what they will fix, block or change in the model between the preview and GA time. Open models can't arrive soon enough.
speedgoose 11 minutes ago [-]
Open models arrived. They are not even that far behind anymore. But the hardware costs are a bit too high for now.
osti 1 hours ago [-]
Sol? Looks like openai is jealous of anthropics good model naming ability and wants to emulate it.
MrCheeze 23 minutes ago [-]
TBF, they did it first with ada/babbage/curie/davinci. "Sol" is a much weaker branding, though.
dominotw 55 minutes ago [-]
sol has no soul
alcasa 51 minutes ago [-]
They should have used Figher Jet codenames instead. The MiG-15 one has a nice ring to it.
arizen 17 minutes ago [-]
Sol Goodman
taytus 51 minutes ago [-]
It's missing u
swe_dima 5 minutes ago [-]
Pleasantly surprised that it costs as GPT 5.5,
thank god for the competition.
jansenmac 17 minutes ago [-]
Will these ad hoc decisions by the U.S. government, without law or clear process, not hurt the coming IPO's of Anthropic and OpenAI?
mekpro 55 minutes ago [-]
We need more coding benchmark score.
Not sure that winning terminalbench 2.1 alone is a clear win over Fable/Mythos yet.
Y_Y 42 minutes ago [-]
But they are the only ones who can benchmark, so the best and only benchmark will be the one where they win. It's just business baby.
simianwords 59 seconds ago [-]
No comments on the cerebras version that might finally enable intelligent voice mode instead of being stuck with 4o-mini class
Agent Arena (Dynamic ranking of models on how well they orchestrate tools for real-world agentic tasks, based on signals like tool reliability, task completion, and steerability.)
Top 10, Highest rank to lowest
Claude Fable 5 (High), Claude Opus 4.8 (Thinking), GPT 5.5 (xHigh), Claude Opus 4.7 (Thinking), GPT 5.5 (High), Claude Opus 4.7, Claude Opus 4.6, GPT 5.5, GPT 5.4 (High), GLM 5.2 (Max)
Text Arena
View overall rankings across various AI models in text-to-text tasks across math, coding, creative writing, and other open-ended domains.
It does not introduce incompatibilities with earlier 5.x models? Frontier models are at a point now that there will never be a need for another major version bump, aside from those chasing marketing gimmicks. They are smart enough to adapt.
ChrisLTD 50 minutes ago [-]
What would it mean to be incompatible with the other 5.x models?
paxys 45 minutes ago [-]
New request/response schema, new capabilities, or really anything that would break your existing workflows if you changed “5.5” to “5.6” in your application.
There have been many leaps forward in the past - tool calling, reasoning, agentic loops etc. 5.6 doesn’t have any of this. More intelligence doesn’t necessarily warrant a major version bump.
jurgenburgen 43 minutes ago [-]
Only speaks Klingon
malnourish 49 minutes ago [-]
A major bump will be warranted if/when we can truly separate prompt from data.
win311fwg 43 minutes ago [-]
That is a different product line. It may be recorded as a version bump for marketing purposes, as already mentioned, but semantically begins at 0.
peab 49 minutes ago [-]
not true. multimodality is still far from being solved
13 minutes ago [-]
corygarms 58 minutes ago [-]
I'll buy that its next generation if the svg bicycle pelican is carrying a baby
MostlyStable 48 minutes ago [-]
Wouldn't that be a stork?
rappatic 34 minutes ago [-]
Seems like OpenAI has succumbed to the urge to give their models catchy names like Anthropic does
derwiki 24 minutes ago [-]
Why not? I’d bet most HN readers don’t know what GPT stands for
alansaber 20 minutes ago [-]
GPT is kind of a stupid name when you stop and think about it.
bluepeter 17 minutes ago [-]
I feel a bit like a Soviet hearing about Levi’s or the latest Springsteen release. C'mon!
OsrsNeedsf2P 16 minutes ago [-]
Like Mythos before it, I'm simply not excited about a model I can't use
sigmoid10 3 minutes ago [-]
At least they plan to give the public all versions. Feels infinitely better than whatever the hell is happening at Anthropic.
> "Yeah, we've got the absolute best model out there. Trust us. Truly scary."
> "O-ok? May I see it?"
> "Gtfo. Here's a worse version of it for you plebs."
> "Um, thanks?"
> "Lmao, actually no. The current admin fell for our scare marketing. Here, have this even worse crazy expensive token burner that gets more hardware limited every week."
woeirua 39 minutes ago [-]
The choice of the name Sol is interesting for those Raised By Wolves fans out there… “Praise Sol!”
vatsachak 44 minutes ago [-]
All of these LLMs are getting better at being at an LLM
But GPT-5.5 is as useful an LLM can be; it has solved lemmas I've thought about for a year, it can implement typed STLCs in Rust when I give it a formal grammar, it can help me analyze Postgres planner dumps.
It's great at tasks that have short solutions but
- they cannot learn based on a project
- their long term planning capabilities are worse than worms
- they are unconfident in decision making
- their internal representations are disgusting compared to JEPA
- they don't have any "system
clock" like humans and computers do
- LLM architecture is not modular like computer architecture or human brain architecture
There's so many issues with LLMs. I wish that companies can start working on the next generation of architectures before the bubble pops
derwiki 17 minutes ago [-]
Totally agree! They also conflate things all the time (a major type of hallucination) and IIUC that can’t be solved with the current architecture, just patched over
32 minutes ago [-]
smeeth 33 minutes ago [-]
The sooner the USG figures out a standard process for approving releases the better. There are many differing opinions on how much to regulate AI, but I think we can all agree ad-hoc policy sucks.
tomComb 55 minutes ago [-]
> We don’t believe this kind of government access process should become the long-term default.
Really glad to see some reasonably prominent pushback against this government overreach.
The information has been reporting that the government wants to individually approve which companies get access and when.
Imagine the wonderful opportunities for corruption and influence peddling, not to mention, excluding any companies that don’t support Trump
paxys 54 minutes ago [-]
A couple of lines in a press release isn’t “pushback”.
Certhas 40 minutes ago [-]
Anthropic broke with US Gov over wanting restrictions and n how they use their model. OpenAI was more than happy to bend over backwards and hide behind a misleading press release.
The idea that OpenAI is the one who are meaningfully pushing back against the USGov is risible.
leumon 1 hours ago [-]
> We plan to make them more broadly available to people using ChatGPT, Codex, and the API soon.
I hope this means then fable will also get released again.
lanthissa 49 minutes ago [-]
why would it? if you're the us gov and sam&greg your good boy giving you 25m
and dario's you naughty boy who you dont agree with politically.
Let 5.6 free, keep fable chained and anthropic instantly sees rev loss and has to cave.
35 minutes ago [-]
mikkelam 26 minutes ago [-]
Would love to see benchmarks on cognition's FrontierCode
bijowo1676 1 hours ago [-]
Waiting for @simonw to report on this, before I read and try it
simonw 45 minutes ago [-]
You might be waiting a while, I'm not in that set of "a small group of trusted partners whose participation has been shared with the government".
minimaxir 39 minutes ago [-]
The government doesn't have a Department of Vector Pelicans?
6thbit 26 minutes ago [-]
They have many that sometimes act like ones
Imustaskforhelp 36 minutes ago [-]
I think that there are some OAI employees on Hackernews. I do believe that they should give access to ya, because after all it would allows us to generate pelicans :-D
What is the consensus on who becomes part of the said small group of trusted partners and if they weren't so opaque about it. I'd expect comparatively big names like Simon to be included within such but Alas its not reality.
simonw 27 minutes ago [-]
I should clarify that I've had plenty of preview access in the past, but clearly this has got a little bit delicate over the past few weeks!
I also don't like writing about preview models that I'm not 100% sure are the same as the general release model, because I don't want to review something which turns out not to be the model everyone else gets to use.
claudeIsDown 57 minutes ago [-]
I would love to see a more descriptive review from simonw instead of just SVGs generations.
He is not an ML researcher or engineer, he is a passionate AI enthusiast blogger. He mostly does SVGs and other low effort checks (sometimes with major flaws, as people have pointed out a few times in the HN comments).
Properly evaluating the model across all fronts requires a deep understanding of LLMs, how they work, the trade offs behind new architectures and the relevant research papers. It also takes a lot of time to build a proper evaluation framework so basically you can't just vibe code that if you want something that is solid.
realty_geek 27 minutes ago [-]
Come on openAI - add @simonw to your privileged team before the plebs start a revolution!!!
52 minutes ago [-]
duggan 46 minutes ago [-]
> As part of our ongoing engagement with the U.S. government, we previewed our plans and the models’ capabilities ahead of today’s launch. At their request, we are starting with a limited preview for a small group of trusted partners whose participation has been shared with the government, before releasing more broadly.
The clowns in the US administration can barely remain coherent from one sentence to the next.
Having them be the gatekeepers of technological progress in 2026 is fucking lame.
johnnyApplePRNG 22 minutes ago [-]
Doesn't it strike anyone as strange that SOL, TERRA, and LUNA are all quasi-scam crypto tickers?
alansaber 21 minutes ago [-]
There is a crypto ticker for literally any catchy short string.
ddwrll 44 minutes ago [-]
What happened to the nano/mini/standard/pro naming scheme, which worked perfectly fine and is intuitive to understand? Why does OpenAI insist on having the most inconsistent and confusing model and product names possible?
I'm looking at you Codex.
00deadbeef 35 minutes ago [-]
It’s still easy to understand as the more capable the model the bigger the celestial body they’re named after.
low_tech_punk 60 minutes ago [-]
all the emphasis on cyber security. feels like a reaction to anthropic, not a real next generation.
tedsanders 53 minutes ago [-]
Yeah, we'll share a lot more details and evals when we can release GPT-5.6 widely. We focused on cyber (and bio) here to help explain why it's being held back for now. We would have loved to launch it to everyone - it's the best coding model I've ever used - and we plan to do so as soon as we can ('coming weeks').
(I work at OpenAI.)
sharksandwich 49 minutes ago [-]
how could that _not_ be the emphasis given what's happened with Anthropic and the Trump admin?
55 minutes ago [-]
nsingh2 1 hours ago [-]
I'm really getting sick of reading about safeguards and what I'm not allowed to do on every model release.
alansaber 15 minutes ago [-]
New guardrails only allow you to code in rust. Just imagine.
KronisLV 51 minutes ago [-]
So, where's the export restrictions?
IAmGraydon 39 minutes ago [-]
Of course the idiots in Washington have bought the hype - hook, line, and sinker.
kristofferR 29 minutes ago [-]
What a party pooper the current US government is... I'm not excited right now at all, while normally a new GPT release would be so much fun to test out.
transcriptase 42 minutes ago [-]
Those taking issue with the clear deference to the current U.S. administration would seemingly prefer it be the exact same degree of preemptive compliance and collaboration, just done behind closed doors as it was with the Biden administration. The sausage is apparently far more palatable when you only find out about the overreach, pressuring, implied threats, and censorship years later in House Judiciary Committees. Or even better if you don’t through use of NSL gag orders or implied threat of lawfare!
andrewlin247 36 minutes ago [-]
they're trying to be anthropic with these model names
1. Naming convention is copied from Anthropic and honestly is more catchy than a number (amongst normal people)
2. How in the world did Anthropic have to do all the theatrics about Mythos just to have OpenAI release an equivalent or stronger model a month later without any drama???
3. Cheaper models are just don’t fit any usecase imo and OpenAI knows it so they keep increasing the floor - I’m still convinced task per capability is reduced with each release
4. How in the world would open source models keep up with the multi layer security? Either this security is all theater or we will finally see a ceiling in open source models because by definition they can’t have those protections
5. Cybersecurity things are boring to me because it’s all zero sum cat and mouse games
thesurlydev 55 minutes ago [-]
Not really news until it's widely available.
Anyone know the latest around Fable being re-released after gov smackdown?
meetpateltech 32 minutes ago [-]
Another model family, another naming scheme to get used to.
Sol Ultra ≈ Pro
Sol ≈ Standard
Terra ≈ Mini
Luna ≈ Nano
alansaber 19 minutes ago [-]
AI marketing washcycle is very efficient.
arendtio 51 minutes ago [-]
I didn't know that I was color blind, but thanks to those charts, I think I need to see a doctor...
I mean, you can read them even without the colors, but who on earth thought that those are a good set of colors? Oh, I forgot it was probably someone on 'Sol'.
kmeisthax 56 minutes ago [-]
> We don’t believe this kind of government access process should become the long-term default. It keeps the best tools from users, developers, enterprises, cyber defenders, and global partners who need them.
My brother in Christ, then why did you (and your competitors) spend years telling the government you needed them to tie your hands behind your back? Did you really think they'd just give you a crown that says "Gatekeeper Of All Neural Networks"?
tmp10423288442 51 minutes ago [-]
In the past few years, that's been primarily Anthropic, right? A lot of the really regulation-oriented people at OpenAI went to Anthropic, particularly after the failed attempt to oust Sam Altman as CEO (that was in late 2023).
sarky-litso 23 minutes ago [-]
brother from another mother here: I don't think they were begging for overreach from the executive branch, likely would have preferred legislation, especially the kind that could be molded by lobbyists.
submeta 45 minutes ago [-]
Are GPT 5.5 and Opus 4.8 the last models we're going te be allowed to use in Europe? Is there going to be a cut, and we're only be allowed to use less capabale models outside of the US?
I mean, if they deem Fable 5 to powerful to share with the rest of the world, what's left for us?
alansaber 14 minutes ago [-]
We have le chaton fat, worry not
da_grift_shift 49 minutes ago [-]
Flagged activity can also trigger account-level review across relevant conversations and risk signals, consistent with our terms and policies around content retention and review. Looking beyond a single conversation helps our systems distinguish persistent malicious behavior from legitimate dual-use security work, where similar technical concepts may appear in very different contexts.
Fascinating!
Every conversation you have with these "more capable" models will be monitored and joined up and then your entire account might one day be tagged as Distiller or Cyber Threat Actor or whatnot. When combined with identity verification (which isn't discussed in this press release), expect people to be falsely flagged and banned from ever using OpenAI models again.
Wish I could find the thread from last week where discussions of exactly this kind of thing were dismissed as daft and outlandish.
paxys 32 minutes ago [-]
> falsely flagged and banned from ever using GPT models again
That would be the best case scenario. More realistically a few wrong prompts is going to get you on a government list, and if you’re an immigrant some dark cell.
alansaber 14 minutes ago [-]
... they have been doing this the entire time
ALittleLight 31 minutes ago [-]
I hate not being able to use the latest models. There needs to be a much faster resolution to whatever is happening with the federal government.
gck1 21 minutes ago [-]
[dead]
w4yai 39 minutes ago [-]
[flagged]
nakedrobot2 1 hours ago [-]
This is disgusting groveling to the Orange Shit Stain.
Beam me up Scotty. No intelligent life forms on this planet.
minimaxir 58 minutes ago [-]
It's either please the Orange or don't release at all (or worse). OpenAI's leverage is limited; even Anthropic folded.
gonzalohm 52 minutes ago [-]
So we just bend down then?
minimaxir 21 minutes ago [-]
Unless you work at OpenAI/Anthropic/etc., you are not a part of the "we".
If you're asking what the average person can do, then the civic perogative is political action to help elect more AI-cognizant leaders.
rvz 1 hours ago [-]
Other than the worst naming I have ever seen (Sol / Terra / Luna), the pricing is still expensive:
> GPT‑5.6 is priced per 1M tokens across three model sizes:
> Sol is $5 input / $30 output;
> Terra is $2.50 input / $15 output
> Luna is $1 input / $6 output.
The OpenAI casino has never been more ready to take your money on gambling even more tokens.
minimaxir 1 hours ago [-]
Note that GPT 5.5 currently is $5 input / $30 output (short context) so Sol is in the same class, while Terra if the benchmarks are as claimed is indeed a half-price GPT 5.5 at comparable performance.
Stitch4223 58 minutes ago [-]
With the $200/month plan I’ve never ran into any limits or issues. The product can be used every day for extensive sessions and development. What is everyone doing that makes them talk about tokens versus dollars?
minimaxir 56 minutes ago [-]
If you've never hit the limits, why not do the $100/mo plan?
nsingh2 43 minutes ago [-]
From what my own experiences are, and what's on their checkout page, $100 is 5x base usage and $200 is 20x. If $100 was 10x, then I personally would drop down. They want people to go to the highest tier.
ai_slop_hater 50 minutes ago [-]
I ran out of usage using GPT-5.5 and had to buy a second subscription. I now switched to GPT-5.4 which is basically 2x usage.
arikrahman 58 minutes ago [-]
Can't buy cheaper as a selling point when Deepseek is basically free when hitting cache? Unsubsidized too, cloudflare and digital ocean can be the model provider for similar pricing.
andrethegiant 1 hours ago [-]
What don't you like about the naming?
lwansbrough 56 minutes ago [-]
I feel like going with Space + Latin is LLM-level creativity.
It's worrying that with no formal and transparent policy framework that the government will be picking winners and losers and stifling innovation.
There's been no public policy, executive order, legislation, or otherwise on this, I wonder if anyone has filed FOIA requests for these decisions or the conversations between the Executive Branch and AI companies.
No amount of rules can stop people who are willing to break them. Only enforcement can.
LLMs are still a little loosey goosey, and we are right on the cusp (if not there already) for an agent to hack a bank and steal money for some rando teenager with a penchant for jail breaking.
The regulations are and will be negative, but don't lose sight of what LLMs can do off the leash.
The appropriate level would be regulation though? Like I just don't get how we can argue that arbitrarily throttling companies is ok.
I like the US approach better: regulate when the need for it arises, not before when you don’t know how the situation is going to evolve.
I agree. But that need has absolutely arisen. The US government is not exactly the best steward for this kind of thing, but some model other than "race each other as fast as we can" is desperately needed here.
I wonder if he understands why, now.
Anthropic was "begging" to make it harder for competing companies to be founded.
I understand it’s very satisfying if you wanted Anthropic “punished” for asking for real regulation to see this. I can’t deny there was a little bit of me at first that felt that way.
It’s untenable, a first order reaction, that I regret intellectually, because if you were against regulation, you’re certainly against waves whatever this is.
ppl are acting like limited release is unprecedented when, in fact, has been the norm until a few years ago.
You can argue that, by government, they meant some legislative process, but I'd argue that regulation via bad executive order is much better than regulation via bad legislation because the former is tractable. I say this as an EO minimalist.
The Project is almost here.
The market will demand such a framework. I suspect that's the larger idea here, in that Amodei not only wants to be in the room when that framework is written, he wants to be at the head of the table.
He apparently wants it so badly he's willing to set back his own company's IPO to make it happen, given that there can be no pure-play AI IPOs until the regulatory picture is sorted out.
As predicted, [0] it has now been applied to OpenAI and soon anyone else releasing highly capable models.
[0] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=48511849
We must clutch our pearls and cite National Security as a reason to pick winners and losers, just like the government did for Fable.
This is not something to joke about, its real.
This is Mr. Fart's Favorite Colors all over again. Our "vetting" process is not any more useful than the billion-dollar metal detector you can skip with a TSA Precheck. It arguably does not deter the most dangerous attacks even slightly. What happens when a mentally-ill pilot locks their copilot out of the cockpit? Well, we write off a crowd of passengers and then "vet" the next jet as a safe vehicle.
AI will be the same way. These "safety" measures are performative and do not even slightly address the actual threat surface of the technology. Arguably, it cannot even be done.
It’s just getting ridiculous at this point. There are plenty of industries regulated and certified by national or international agencies. And no they don’t get to do what they want.
First of all, who said this is a disaster?
Second of all, OP never even said anything about no regulation - they specifically said they wanted transparency which is 100% valid and better than a world where the government baby proofs everything for you
Models are already censored - and who they are or aren't uncensored for has a lot of implications which are way worse
And the jets is a terrible example - you picked one of THE highest regulated industries where NOBODY has a problem with regulation
This amount of courting the current administration is pretty scary imo.
That’s ironic – I interpreted that paragraph with the opposite slant: positively. If that’s what the government mandates then these companies, in the end, have little choice, so was at least relieved to see them publicly pushing back.
They absolutely do have a choice, Anthropic and OpenAI could fight it in court. Iran showed Trump is a coward, he wouldn't risk tanking the only industry still keeping the stock market growing.
https://www.nytimes.com/2026/06/04/podcasts/the-daily/trump-...
Despite their virtue signaling, Anthropic is the only major lab that has never released an open weights model, has been caught intentionally nerfing a model after release (Opus 4.6), intentionally and silently degrades performance for suspected competitors and AI researchers, complains incessantly about distillation when everyone is doing it (and after they settled for pirating books), and wants to pull the ladder out from everyone trying to catch up.
They're anti-consumer and only concerned with holding the power themselves. I'm not a fan of Altman, but Anthropic is the worst actor in the space, and I hope they lose.
https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=48465269
If you can't envision plausible scenarios where very bad things happen because of a malevolent actor, ChatGPT 6, and a little bad luck - you need to think harder.
I mean, it seems like common sense - a limited beta test before widespread rollout. I'm not convinced they'll ever come up with a good framework for dealing with the cyber & bio issues, but getting triggered by a beta test rollout seems overboard.
I have zero confidence that this particular administration has any interest in regulating the industry for the good of the country, much less for the good of humanity. They will use regulation to maximize personal profit for themselves and their cronies, at the expense of the nation. I would not have thought that of any other US administration in the past 100 years.
In the longer run, it probably won't matter. If the level of corruption we see currently becomes the norm, then the US is facing much bigger problems than counter-productive industrial policy.
- GPT-5 mini costs $0.25/$2 and will be discontinued in December.
- GPT-5.4 mini costs $0.75/$4.5 and is supposed to be the replacement.
- GPT-5.4 nano costs $0.2/$1.25 and, while it ranks better in benchmarks than GPT-5 mini, it's not even close when you test it in real scenarios.
So you're left being forced to go to GPT 5.4 mini if you use 5 mini today.
The same thing is happening here as their “Luna“ model will cost $1/$6.
Can't we just stay with the models we actually want? I don't need GPT 5.4 mini. GPT-5 does the job.
Maybe it’s the realization that it was never that cheap in the first place and they're forcing us to upgrade in a slow and painful way.
I really dislike this rhetoric, you sound like the FSF guys who are like "you're not free until you're running coreboot with zero binary blobs". Sure they have a point but also, most people are fine running regular linux.
Fable itself is hosted on all major cloud providers. How many offer it today?
And if you are a legit American business you aren’t going to illegally bypass import/export controls.
Eventually the pricing should be more stable.
Why do you think so? This game can be played forever, you just need strong marketing and orgs gullible enough to pay a higher price for a minor upgrade.
will trigger re-evaluations of models by other labs + inference providers
See Uber, Netflix, etc.
How many people do you see using haiku or sonnet? I see very few and most people default to the latest model and just play with thinking effort. I think three layers are good enough and supporting more is not a good UX.
Inference needs to cache, it can't cache random model data, so it's essentially dedicated; it can't spin up models on demand, it has to know what demand is coming.
These companies are going to end up with very few models offered and that's probably generous. They might end up with just one model and you pay for removing it's safe guards.
These models aren't even that smart and they are already trying to control them and lock them down to a handful of people.
Then these executive and VC wonder why people hate AI and are against them.
Because the future is heading toward intelligence for the rich and you stuck with whatever model they want you to have.
The next step is banning open source models.
The future is not looking so bright if these models are already going locked down to whoever the government what's to have them.
This is no different than the government banning books because they don't want you to learn.
Recently, I went head-to-head with GPT on nearly 2,000 lines of code, and GPT's solution was superior and faster. I even referenced multiple codebases on GitHub while trying, but they were incomparable to GPT.
So using GPT brings both fear and excitement.
The fear comes from realizing that this level of code is now the average for most people. The excitement comes from knowing that I can now study and learn at this level too.
I'm really looking forward to seeing how much more advanced the code will be with the upgrade to 5.6.
On the contrary, pi + glm + DeepSeek… bliss.
Fable was a different kind of beast though. Rip.
For most important work (complex, cross-domain inquiries etc.), I still rely on Codex GPT 5.5 though.
I'm working in a 600k+ LoC codebase that has complex domain-specific logic and lots of moving parts. I find that Codex 5.5 is pretty good at surgical fixes, but does not go out of its way to explore and figure out what those surgical fixes might break. So I only use it to work on parts of the system that are pretty isolated from everything else so that risk of regression is small.
Seems odd that their announcement has zero coding benchmarks, with the closest relating thing being terminal bench.
Personally, I think this kind of coding experience varies from person to person
Well, GPT referenced every GitHub code base, no wonder it won! :)
-Why do you cut API boundaries this way? -Why do you change the order of struct fields? -Why do you deliberately insert padding?
Most of it depends on the background and context. Sometimes you add it, sometimes you don't. To understand this tacit knowledge, you need access to senior developers. But their attitude often depends on how promising the student is and what background they come from. On top of that, you don't have to rely on the respondent's mood, authority, or availability.
Programming is fundamentally a field that requires seniors. In my case, I had no such seniors at all. I learned to code by buying codebases from failed companies and studying them. My first job didn't hire me as an employee—they hired me as the CEO of a subcontracting company (because that was structurally more advantageous for the contract). So I wasn't given the patience to learn programming fundamentals gradually. I had to pay penalties if I failed. Most of the projects I worked on were the kind where failure meant bankruptcy for me. Naturally, there was no one to teach me.
Most of my knowledge comes from reverse-engineering the code I purchased.
People say LLM code contains falsehoods, but commercially sold code has always had falsehoods too. Honestly, if we're just talking ratios, LLM code has fewer falsehoods.
In that sense, I still think it's a matter of context. If LLM code is false, was human code ever really true? LLMs do lie. They generate plenty of incorrect code. But humans do the same thing. If a problem comes up, you just look it up then and there. For me, LLMs and humans aren't all that different.
I'm curious about how does this work? Do the subagents also get to use the same tools? Will the client be flooded with tool calls? Why extra pricing for a new "model" when the same thing can happen in the client with more controls?
And if it's an army of subagents, why do they compare it to Fable and Mythos? Those models with similar harness would probably bench better I'm guessing
It's essentially a bunch of subagents being called by a deterministic script written by the main model thread, each eating tokens for lunch and output of which is synthesized by an orchestrator agent.
It's for sure a codex harness feature.
EDIT: yeah, it's the same thing. https://github.com/openai/codex/blob/main/codex-rs/core/test...
The Anthropic page here seems to say that Max users should have access to the full 1 Million window for 4.8:
https://support.claude.com/en/articles/8606394-how-large-is-...
I was already setting up my infra to experiment with GLM 5.2 and its 1 Million token window before this happened. I think I'm glad I did.
The excuse they give is borderline childish. I get the thing about slow rollout, make sure partners get to fix the bugs, etc...
But bad actors are hard working motivated entities with tens of thousand of fake ids, and american citizens working for them, for pennies.
All while the ones like or you sit at a crossfire which is borderline useless.
I cant wait to see what Qwen did with the massive distillation they made out of Opus 4.8 and Fable aka Mythos aka pretty sure they jailbroke it.
"We're also launching GPT‑5.6 Sol on Cerebras at up to 750 tokens per second in July, bringing frontier intelligence to customers at unprecedented speed. Access will initially be limited to select customers as we expand capacity."
750 tokens/s on a frontier model is going to be extremely interesting. I doubt this new version is anything but a version bump in terms of capabilities but if we can start getting these answers back faster, they end up being more useful.
Just off the top of my head, I can think of the tedious task of finding certain functionality within a codebase. I usually can't beat an AI agent harness at this task today. If the AI model is 3x faster I have less of chance.
This is really exciting. I work on voice AI, and we're still using 4.1/4.1 mini since none of the frontier models come close on latency. I'm excited to be able to have more interactive experiences, I think it'll unlock new ways of working with these models.
If what you need is only possible with the more capable model then the "affordability" of the less capable model is sort of irrelevant. If what you need is a novel mathematical proof, it doesn't matter that a high school student is "more affodable". You need the math PhD.
As "old" models get more and more capable, it's going to be an increasingly important skill to be able to adequately recognize when a task requires a frontier model and when it doesn't, so that the less capable (and therefore cheaper) model can be used.
If it was the next generation, why isn't it a major version change..?
Calling it 5.6 creates the least possible expectations, and therefore more potential for positive feedback.
The Sol/Terra/Luna naming is interesting. I wonder what Anthropic are considering for their next models? "Terminator", "Armageddon"?
Even Apple adopted and standardized on it for their latest platform releases.
Multiple weeks!
Not just 5 work days, but at least 10!
(I work at OpenAI.)
If this is the new norm, we as workers should all start look for jobs in those companies.
I'm very glad to see them say this explicitly and prominently.
Who knows what they will fix, block or change in the model between the preview and GA time. Open models can't arrive soon enough.
Agent Arena (Dynamic ranking of models on how well they orchestrate tools for real-world agentic tasks, based on signals like tool reliability, task completion, and steerability.)
Top 10, Highest rank to lowest
Claude Fable 5 (High), Claude Opus 4.8 (Thinking), GPT 5.5 (xHigh), Claude Opus 4.7 (Thinking), GPT 5.5 (High), Claude Opus 4.7, Claude Opus 4.6, GPT 5.5, GPT 5.4 (High), GLM 5.2 (Max)
Text Arena View overall rankings across various AI models in text-to-text tasks across math, coding, creative writing, and other open-ended domains.
Top 10, Highest rank to lowest
claude-fable-5, claude-opus-4-6-thinking, claude-opus-4-7-thinking, claude-opus-4-6, claude-opus-4-7, muse-spark, gemini-3.1-pro-preview, gemini-3-pro, claude-opus-4-8-thinking, gpt-5.5-high
There have been many leaps forward in the past - tool calling, reasoning, agentic loops etc. 5.6 doesn’t have any of this. More intelligence doesn’t necessarily warrant a major version bump.
> "Yeah, we've got the absolute best model out there. Trust us. Truly scary."
> "O-ok? May I see it?"
> "Gtfo. Here's a worse version of it for you plebs."
> "Um, thanks?"
> "Lmao, actually no. The current admin fell for our scare marketing. Here, have this even worse crazy expensive token burner that gets more hardware limited every week."
But GPT-5.5 is as useful an LLM can be; it has solved lemmas I've thought about for a year, it can implement typed STLCs in Rust when I give it a formal grammar, it can help me analyze Postgres planner dumps.
It's great at tasks that have short solutions but
- they cannot learn based on a project
- their long term planning capabilities are worse than worms
- they are unconfident in decision making
- their internal representations are disgusting compared to JEPA
- they don't have any "system clock" like humans and computers do
- LLM architecture is not modular like computer architecture or human brain architecture
There's so many issues with LLMs. I wish that companies can start working on the next generation of architectures before the bubble pops
Really glad to see some reasonably prominent pushback against this government overreach.
The information has been reporting that the government wants to individually approve which companies get access and when.
Imagine the wonderful opportunities for corruption and influence peddling, not to mention, excluding any companies that don’t support Trump
The idea that OpenAI is the one who are meaningfully pushing back against the USGov is risible.
I hope this means then fable will also get released again.
and dario's you naughty boy who you dont agree with politically.
Let 5.6 free, keep fable chained and anthropic instantly sees rev loss and has to cave.
What is the consensus on who becomes part of the said small group of trusted partners and if they weren't so opaque about it. I'd expect comparatively big names like Simon to be included within such but Alas its not reality.
I also don't like writing about preview models that I'm not 100% sure are the same as the general release model, because I don't want to review something which turns out not to be the model everyone else gets to use.
The clowns in the US administration can barely remain coherent from one sentence to the next.
Having them be the gatekeepers of technological progress in 2026 is fucking lame.
I'm looking at you Codex.
(I work at OpenAI.)
https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=48678789
https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=48683021
1. Naming convention is copied from Anthropic and honestly is more catchy than a number (amongst normal people)
2. How in the world did Anthropic have to do all the theatrics about Mythos just to have OpenAI release an equivalent or stronger model a month later without any drama???
3. Cheaper models are just don’t fit any usecase imo and OpenAI knows it so they keep increasing the floor - I’m still convinced task per capability is reduced with each release
4. How in the world would open source models keep up with the multi layer security? Either this security is all theater or we will finally see a ceiling in open source models because by definition they can’t have those protections
5. Cybersecurity things are boring to me because it’s all zero sum cat and mouse games
Anyone know the latest around Fable being re-released after gov smackdown?
Sol Ultra ≈ Pro
Sol ≈ Standard
Terra ≈ Mini
Luna ≈ Nano
I mean, you can read them even without the colors, but who on earth thought that those are a good set of colors? Oh, I forgot it was probably someone on 'Sol'.
My brother in Christ, then why did you (and your competitors) spend years telling the government you needed them to tie your hands behind your back? Did you really think they'd just give you a crown that says "Gatekeeper Of All Neural Networks"?
I mean, if they deem Fable 5 to powerful to share with the rest of the world, what's left for us?
Every conversation you have with these "more capable" models will be monitored and joined up and then your entire account might one day be tagged as Distiller or Cyber Threat Actor or whatnot. When combined with identity verification (which isn't discussed in this press release), expect people to be falsely flagged and banned from ever using OpenAI models again.
Wish I could find the thread from last week where discussions of exactly this kind of thing were dismissed as daft and outlandish.
That would be the best case scenario. More realistically a few wrong prompts is going to get you on a government list, and if you’re an immigrant some dark cell.
Beam me up Scotty. No intelligent life forms on this planet.
If you're asking what the average person can do, then the civic perogative is political action to help elect more AI-cognizant leaders.
> GPT‑5.6 is priced per 1M tokens across three model sizes:
> Sol is $5 input / $30 output;
> Terra is $2.50 input / $15 output
> Luna is $1 input / $6 output.
The OpenAI casino has never been more ready to take your money on gambling even more tokens.
Edit: yeah. https://claude.ai/share/06fefe02-4299-44da-8c5a-42607f54ca77